Brooklyn Community Gardeners

OH, RATS!

Guess Who Came To Dinner? And Lunch? It ain't funny.

Composting had to be (temporarily) suspended in September 2006 because rats had been sighted on and around the garden's compost bins.

Composting is expected to resume around Thanksgiving; rat-proofing continues around the compost bins.

HERE'S THE ADVICE I GOT VIA EMAIL....

I was talking to a fellow gardener at my local community garden and he suggested that it is most important to find where the rats food source is. What is enticing them? If you have a compost program in your garden you should not put food in open areas but in closed bins. If you remove the food source the rats will leave (hopefully). Good luck

Marybeth
mkeenley@juno.com

I recommend Hav-a-Hart traps. That way you can look inside at the captured
beastie before you decide whether to "have a heart" or not.
----Mike McG
PS: NOT!
Conventional wisdom is that rats need 4 things - food, water, harborage
(place to burrow), and cover. Remove any or all of those things, and
they tend to go away. That means:
- Don't have any standing water in your garden - no containers that will
collect rain water, for instance.
- Harvest crops when they are ripe, and keep them off of the ground.
Don't let "spoiled" fruits sit on the ground. Grow crops vertically as
much as possible.
- Elevate composters about a foot and turn them often. Chop materials
before you add them to the composters. Line composters with hardware
cloth.
- If you find rat burrows, break them up and/or fill them with soil or
other materials. Pick up pieces of wood, etc. that provide good
protection for burrow entrances.
- Pull, kill, or remove weeds, particularly along fence lines. Try to
keep an area clear of cover about 200 feet beyond the edges of your
garden.
Most of these are just good garden hygiene. You can get fancier.
Remember that gardens don't cause rats. They have to come from
somewhere else. Your real problem may be outside the garden,
particularly if you are good about cleaning out the garden before
winter.
Good luck.
JH

Jack N. Hale
Executive Director
Knox Parks Foundation
75 Laurel Street
Hartford, CT 06106
860/951-7694
Hi, Emily - We have found no alternative to rat bait. The organic "humane" solutions are cost
prohibitive. We use Tomcat rat bait houses that are locked and secured. The squirrels are too big
to get into the housing unit and the same for other wildlife/animals. The bait is on a secured rod
within the housing unit and is not loose.

The houses do have to be baited on a monthly basis until you can get some control.

Good luck!

Kathleen Cobb, President
Sunshine Community Gardens
Austin, TX
I have heard that peppermint oil from the health food store keeps rodents
away. I have no personal experience with this but it may be worth a try.
Apparently, you soak some cotton balls with the oil and put them around your
property.
Good luck,
Rebekah
you can find their nest
generally a hole - burrow
you can fill it but b4 u do that flood it with water -
do this repeatedly
fill it with rubble (smallish course rock)
- so it is hard for them to dig it over again -

let us know what happens

c

On 9/11/06, Patrick McCarty wrote:
Emily,

Construction disturbs rodents' homes. You'll need to
work with adjacent community to discourage rats.
(Probably impossible to eliminate them, without the
use of extreme measures.) A couple of cats casting
their scent. Other predator scents, too, may
discourage the critters.

Visit here: http://bugspray.com/

If you want, I have a couple of have-a-heart traps.
This route doesn't provide temporary or permanent
solution.

Please keep me in the loop. Your answer may guide
other gardens.

Pat

Alice Gleason said that
"Oil of peppermint is also a cat deterrent. I apply it to the frames
and loose cushions of two upholstered antique rocking chairs, and
Malcolm avoids them completely. The oil, not the extract or the
leaf, is effective it apparently is concentrated enough to irritate
the cat's sensitive nose. I suspect that holds true for Ricky Rat as
well. ( I have not seen any rats on my antique rocking chairs, by the
way.)"

Dear all:
Thank you so much for all your input re: the rats, composting, etc. We really believe that the
majority of the rats are in the garden due to displacement from building in the area and that the
compost is a secondary factor not a primary one.
Other secondary factors are:
1.) food left on the vines and trees, i.e. tomatoes. Berries, etc that don't get picked but are
left to rot. 2.) Habitats this includes overgrown and shrubby plots if you have any
plants that are seeding and or have finished flowering, please remove them.
3.) Food left out for other animals or people The Compost bins have:
1) had a mesh placed over all the bins
2) will have interior steel mesh placed inside the bins (Indore as well as "home" bins")
3) a lid made and placed over the 1st bin
The Park Slope Food Coop is interested in helping us with these costs.
What members can do:
1) Suspend composting for now until we can update the bins (we're not looking for new ones)
2) Pick any food in your garden, get others to do the same (we may just need a general garden
clean up where we pick everything regardless who is there: if that happens it will be
announced beforehand)
3) Remove any and all debris and/or brush from your garden (this is an ideal habitat for rats)
4) Stop feeding the cats (Marmalade is HUGE right now not feeding will not cause any due
stress for a week or 2)
5) All garbage MUST go in the garbage cans with lids closed
6) If you are in the garden and the 1st compost bin isn't correctly covered with browns by all
means cover it a hot compost bin is our best deterrent to rodents.

Thank you all for your input and insight We will keep you posted!!!! Sheila
Rat problem aside, Marmalade is definitely not huge
right now. In fact, he has recently lost a good deal
of weight. Because of his long fur, it can be hard to
see, but if you look closely or run a hand over his
backbone, it is very apparent. Several people have
noticed, and I am thinking we may want to take up a
collection to take him to the vet.

Cats can mask illness very well until it is quite
serious, but the amount of weight Marmalade has lost
recently is almost certainly the sign of a health
problem. It could be something as simple as worms, or
something more serious such as early thyroid, kidney,
or liver problems. If enough of us chip in $10 or so,
we should be able to cover basic diagnostics (blood
work, stool analysis, and urinalysis) without trouble.

In the meantime, if food is to be removed, we should
probably arrange to make sure someone sits with him
while he eats a couple times a day. If not, I fear it
WILL cause quite a bit of stress to his system.

This is not meant to criticize Sheila in any way. It
is very easy to miss weight loss under long fur. I am
used to watching for it from years of tending cats
through sickness and health, including one with long
fur, and I have been meaning to send out an email
about Marmalade's health for the past week.

Please let me know if you are interested in
contributing to taking Marmalade to the vet.

Thank you,

Annie Fox
Hey Annie:
I'm sure the garden can cover a visit for Marmalade to go the Vet and anyone
who wants to take a time in a feeding schedule for him would be great!
Would you like to set those two things up??? I'll check with the Steering
Committee for funds if you can give me a general idea of costs. You're
right - it isn't always easy to tell if you don't know the cat well - and I
have taken so many cats to the vet from the garden over the years, at least
we've had Marmalade around for a while! That's kudos to all who have cared
for him over the years. Thanks Annie for your concern.
Sheila
I lived next door to a community garden for years. They were the ultimate poster children for a PC
lifestyle. Thanks to compost and nearby construction, they become OVER RUN with rats- and this
was particularly devastating because they shared part of the space with a nursery school
playground.
The approach started out gently with trap and release units ( not sure where they intended to
release them!). That failed. They brought in all kinds of humane people to consult, and each thing
that they did failed. They put out those black triangular trap boxes ( not sure if they all trap or just
poison). That failed. Finally they got spring traps and the problem was solved- 13 rats in the first
week alone.
AMY
I don't know if this will help, but we had an issue a couple of years ago in our house. Metro Pest
Control came in and used a non toxic puddy where the rats were coming in - and then sealed the
holes with the wire scrubbing material used to clean dishes (I'm drawing a blank on the name).
Not sure if you can identify where they are coming from Good luck. Anne

Dear Annie and Emily,

I just spoke with Celeste Coutinho, the 15th Street resident who
hosts Marmalade in the cooler months. She is returning from Portugal
this week and will take over the care and feeding of Marmalade. She
is aware that he is thin and will take him to a vet if necessary.

Regards,
Alice
Friends, Remember the Jack Russell terrier on Kelsey Grammer TV series "Frasier,"? Adorable,
no? Well...the Jack Russell terrier, traditionally trained is the ultimate "mad-dog killer," of rats and
other small vermin. They are truly vicious, when their are discouraged from being "cute," and are
their natural "Cujo" selves. For this the Jack Russell Terrier was bred.
The ultimate rat killing machine.
Year ago on the lower east side, Chinatown, Harlem and certain select parts of the yet
ungentrified Upper West Side, there was a rather droll Welshman who trawled the streets in
an old Volvo with six, count 'em six, Jack Russell terriers, looking for "scouts, " usually kids or
street people who would tip him off to basements and apartments to clean out with his "troop."
Known as, "that crazy dog man," that "white man with the killer dogs," or "Lord Ratman," and
variants thereof, this guy wore a tweed jacket, cap, always carried a hip flask, had a wildly veined
alcholic's nose that I swear shone like something out of the "Pickwick Papers," thick
deerskin gloves, smoked a pipe filled with Balkan Sobranie.
you cannot make up someone like this - God or the Devil sends these people to walk the earth...
"Lord Ratman," a valuable service for several communities - organic, non-poisonous rodent
abatement (earth friendly, as some of our Kumbaya singing comrades might say) in persuit of
blood sport.
And the cute, "Frasier," type Jack Russell terriers were as vicious as pirahna or Vice President
Cheyney.
I saw one Jack Russell down a hole in the old Liz Christy garden, the earth literally shook above
the hole, and watched it pull up a Norway rat larger than it was to praise ( and piece of raw liver)
from "Lord Ratman."
In retrospect, "Lord Ratman," had to have been a semi-pathological individual, but he was loved
on certain streets of NYC, where the city's "rat patrol," feared to tread. And for weeks after he had
left a building, nobody's baby got bitten -
As Martha Stewart would say, " a good thing."
Thinking of MAD DOGS, Welshmen, rat abatement and gardens,
Adam Honigman
Gardener,
Hell's Kitchen New York

-----Original Message-----
From: jackh@knoxparks.org
To: emilyholiday@gmail.com; BQLT.Communications@gmail.com
Cc: ParkSlopeParents@yahoogroups.com; NYC-GardensCoalition@yahoogroups.com;
community_garden-request@mallorn.com; community_garden@mallorn.com
Sent: Mon, 11 Sep 2006 4:12 PM
Subject: RE: [cg] rats, solutions to
Conventional wisdom is that rats need 4 things - food, water, harborage
(place to burrow), and cover. Remove any or all of those things, and
they tend to go away. That means:
Don't have any standing water in your garden - no containers
that will
collect rain water, for instance.
Harvest crops when they are ripe, and keep them off of the
ground.
Don't let "spoiled" fruits sit on the ground. Grow crops vertically as
much as possible.
Elevate composters about a foot and turn them often. Chop
materials
before you add them to the composters. Line composters with hardware
cloth.
If you find rat burrows, break them up and/or fill them with
soil or
other materials. Pick up pieces of wood, etc. that provide good
protection for burrow entrances.
Pull, kill, or remove weeds, particularly along fence lines.
Try to
keep an area clear of cover about 200 feet beyond the edges of your
garden.
Most of these are just good garden hygiene. You can get fancier.
Remember that gardens don't cause rats. They have to come from
somewhere else. Your real problem may be outside the garden,
particularly if you are good about cleaning out the garden before
winter.
Good luck.
JH
Jack N. Hale
Executive Director
Knox Parks Foundation
75 Laurel Street
Hartford, CT 06106
860/951-7694
Boy do I wish your "Lord Ratman" was still around. Much better than
trying to lure owls or keeping a ferret Illegally to take care of the
rats!
It's precisely because the rats are looking for water that they eat the
nice juicy tomatoes. And not just those close to the ground, either.
You can also watch rats climb the stalk of a sunflower to get at the
seeds. Filling in the burrows with stones often only leads to a new
"dig" right next to the filled-in spot. Even putting a nasty packet of
poison all the way down before closing the burrow doesn't help for
long.
Do you suppose someone might come forward to take the place ot the
aforementioned "Ratman"? Or is that too much to hope for?
Good luck to all who are infested.
Renata (Rockwell Pl. Garden)

Dear Emily and all interested recipients,
Off the top of my head at midnight
Rats are usually drawn to grains and animal products, so keep them both
out of your compost. Only browns and greens! (I'm sure you already
know this, but --- Browns are high in carbon, greens high in nitrogen.
Browns are dead leaves, twigs, dry grasses, newspaper and brown paper.
Greens are fresh cuttings, veggie scraps. Fruit rinds can be a
problem.)
I'm sure you will get more info from others. Also sent on your request
to the animal rights listserve (without your contact name or email) and
to a good friend; if something good shows up, I'll send it on to you.
JK
As any good environmentalist knows, there's no such thing as "away," as
in "throw away." If your goal for garden rats is total extermination,
you are deluding yourself. If they are around, they will stay around.
In general, your task is to get them to be in places that have less
negative impact on your garden/life. So, stirring up burrows means that
you are paying attention, and that is always a good thing. Undisturbed,
unnoticed burrows are what allows/encourages rat populations to settle
in and grow. If you disturb them, they may at first re-dig the same
holes. If you continue to disturb them, they will try to find a
sheltered spot where they can dig and live in peace. If you practice
good garden hygiene, they will tend not to find that place in your
garden.
Disturbing burrows also means that for a little while rats may be more
vulnerable to predators because they won't have as many handy bolt
holes. We have some friendly red tailed hawks here that appreciate our
efforts to feed them.
In general, there is no single "solution," just a bunch of activities
that help address the problem.
By the way, this is a very different strategy than is employed for
rodent control in buildings where sealing up and extermination are the
order of the day.
Good luck.
JH
Jack N. Hale
Executive Director
Knox Parks Foundation
75 Laurel Street
Hartford, CT 06106
860/951-7694



From: Joanne Morse [mailto:Joanne.Morse@tpl.org]
Sent: Monday, September 18, 2006 5:39 PM
To: BQLT.Communications@gmail.com; emilyholiday@gmail.com;
Jack Hale
Cc: community_garden@mallorn.com; community_garden-
request@mallorn.com; NYC-GardensCoalition@yahoogroups.com; ParkSlopeParents@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [cg] rats, solutions to
Jack, you recommend breaking up rat burrows, filling with soil,
etc. Seems like that just makes them dig another burrow, so now you've
got two messed up parts of the garden. just to confirm - you do find
that breaking up the burrows encourages them to go away?

Joanne Morse
NYC Program Manager
The Trust for Public Land
666 Broadway, 9th Floor
New York, NY 10012
The Trust for Public Land - Conserving land for people since 1972.
Because everyone needs a place to play outdoors. www.tpl.org
P: 212-677-7171
F: 212-353-2052
joanne.morse@tpl.org
http://www.tpl.org

COMPOSTING HAS RESUMED - as of November 28, 2006

Hi everyone,

Yes, thanks to many efforts and many hours of work especially Janet Murray and Sheila McDevitt, compost bin number one has been retrofitted to be rat-proof and upgraded and is ready for composting.

please follow the compost guidelines as posted and cut or chop small. If you have any questions please call or email me.

Rot rules.

sincerely,
Maureen

p.s. Modino has moved to Park Slope, our new phone number is 718.768.0001.

Maureen O'Brien
www.MODINO.com
Modino Design
Custom Publication, Print, Web and
Graphic Design for Green & Sustainable
Businesses, Organizations and Foundations
478 Twelfth Street
room 1L
Brooklyn, NY 11215
718.768.0001 x201

Email us
emilyholiday@gmail.com